I'll be brave...

Devenshack · 05-07-2008, 01:55 AM

Thats why I love the rare case when you bring that A hole inmate out there that is straight up thug and treats the nurses like he treats us. That way they get to see what we deal with and it opens their eyes.

dblbass · 05-07-2008, 03:17 AM

BOP = Bureau Offered Pacifier (Program)

BOP = "Back Out Punk!", the inmate tells the officer, as the officer enters the cell to conduct a search.

Anyone have any other ideas?

AZCorrections84 · 05-08-2008, 01:44 PM

I tend to think it all went downhill when someone decided that inmates should have rights while in prison. While they do lose quite a few rights, I feel that they retain too many, especially while behind bars.

Giving them all these rights in essence took the power and control away from the CO. I believe that's what started this whole hug a thug prison system. We MUST cater to these inmates because if we don't, they will sue. If we beat them down, they will sue. If we look at them funny they will sue. Do I think it's necessary to go beat the heck out of an inmate just because? No, but do I think a good beat-down to get an inmate into compliance, or to stop resisting, or to breakup an incident may be justifiable to a certain degree? Perhaps I do think that way to some extent. However, I'm not in any position to justify that degree because I just can't know, I never worked in the previous prison system where that was 'alright.'

It's such a different thought process when you look through the history of prisons in America. Administrations everywhere wanted to get away from the perception that 'guards' are just knuckle draggers who go around kicking inmates. A change was made for departments to become more professional in manner which sadly included giving inmates more rights in order to combat the random beat-downs and mistreatment of inmates.

However, did these people that decided that inmates should have rights actually consider what they did? Probably not. They also failed to realize what rights were taken from the victims of these offenders. I tend to think it's the victims that will eternally suffer much more than any inmate ever will. He's out of prison when his sentence is up, and he doesn't have to think about it ever again if he/she so chooses. The victim has to live with it forever.

PsychoMike · 05-08-2008, 04:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gijanetexas

So, when I start my Master's in Criminal Justice this fall (I hope), I'll learn all this?

My opinion is that custody and corrections basically works when staff watch inmates.

The BOP used to be good at that back in the day (Alcatraz), but now we make inmates pseudo-staff (quasi-staff) to save money, they have privacy, so that has gone out the door/window/garage.

Also, in the opinion of a crusty, old, deceased CO I knew as Uncle Spike (think your perverted Uncle you had growing up, but I worshiped the ground the man walked on), the modern corrections is good for the inmates (direct supervision, or "management by walking around" BOP style) but highly stresssful on the staff.

Inmates get everything handed to them now, he told me, so they have no incentive for them to respect the staff.

GIJANE... mull this over. Back around 1974 when I started to study corrections and Utah Sate Law Enforcement... I ran across this; "Prison should be ultimately designed to do away with itself. That is to say, it should be motivation in and of itself to keep inmates from returning once they've been there." What they mean there I think is that NO ONE should want to return to prison and, when they come out, word of mouth should be that "You don't want to go there" is the only attitude conveyed to any and all who come into contact with an ex-con. However; now that prison is it's own industry, it is beneficial to have inmates return again and again. How many times have you seen prison, inmates, gang members and thugs glorified in the movies? Now it's "Cool" to be a "Gangsta" Also, how many times have you heard other staff say, “Well it’s job security” when they are commenting on inmates returning. That is the WRONG attitude as far as I’m concerned... As a society we should be doing EVERYTHING to eliminate crime, criminals and the need for prisons. So some of us are out of a job.. You think that prison is the only job you can do? Think about what a place the United States would be if we put as much effort into eliminating the motivation, the “coolness” if you will, of crime and doing time as we put into blowing up foreign countries and killing terrorists.... Wouldn’t THIS be a nice place to live?

OK...so I'm a long winded old gas bag - fire me!

PsychoMike · 05-08-2008, 04:22 PM

Perhaps it'd be useful to allow the VICTIMS to decide the fate of their tormentors!

Now THAT I'd like to see.

PsychoMike · 05-08-2008, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GUNNER

Absolutely true. In addition to that they have taken all the authority away from the Officers, so now when an Officer says anything to an inmate they immediately want to see a LT. Guess what, the LT will always run as hard as he can to please that inmate to.

NOW THAT IS OFFENSIVE! I DARE YOU TO ASK ANY STAFF THAT WORKED WITH ME FOR THE FIFTEEN YEARS I WAS A LIEUTENANT AND FIND OUT HOW MANY OF THEM WILL BACK YOU UP ON THAT! I think you will find the consensus is that they freaked out when I lit up an inmate's ass in the office. I scared more newbies yelling at inmates than I can count. There were a few that needed hands on training, but it was rare. I've had dozens of staff tell me that I scared the **** out of THEM yelling at inmates. It's a tool and one of many, but I NEVER catered to an inmate - they got ONLY what policy said they get - nothing more - nothing less. If they cooperated, I did too, but they never were catered to by me!

Devenshack · 05-08-2008, 05:13 PM

Its not like as co's we are asking for the world. If you think about it, we are the police inside the walls. We should be afforded the same respect and authority that Police have on the streets as well. You dont get the on the beat cop calling his LT everytime he needs to arrest someone, yet we do. If they make a decision to take a suspect down in pursuit, they are not torn down like we would be. Plus then again, in most of the movies the Police are still the good guys so public perception is that they are good while we are still always the bad ones.

BOPSOS · 05-08-2008, 09:15 PM

That's the difference between the STATE and County and the Bureau. In state or county if you had a problem with the thugs it got taken care of and NO QUESTIONS ASKED!!!!!!!!!!. The KGB(KINDER < GENTLER< BUREAU) thats a different story. These guy's will rat out their own moms. That was the biggest problem I had 10yrs ago coming to the Bureau. I figured these guy's would Police them selves.......WRONG.

Gaoler · 05-08-2008, 09:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BOPSOS

That's the difference between the STATE and County and the Bureau. In state or county if you had a problem with the thugs it got taken care of and NO QUESTIONS ASKED!!!!!!!!!!. The KGB(KINDER < GENTLER< BUREAU) thats a different story. These guy's will rat out their own moms. That was the biggest problem I had 10yrs ago coming to the Bureau. I figured these guy's would Police them selves.......WRONG.

Not all states. VT is worse than the BOP, believe me. You cannot get more hug-a-thug. It is physically impossible. I'm surprised we don't offer congegal visits for guys in the hole.

koepdaddy · 05-08-2008, 09:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PsychoMike

GIJANE... mull this over. Back around 1974 when I started to study corrections and Utah Sate Law Enforcement... I ran across this; "Prison should be ultimately designed to do away with itself. That is to say, it should be motivation in and of itself to keep inmates from returning once they've been there." What they mean there I think is that NO ONE should want to return to prison and, when they come out, word of mouth should be that "You don't want to go there" is the only attitude conveyed to any and all who come into contact with an ex-con. However; now that prison is it's own industry, it is beneficial to have inmates return again and again. How many times have you seen prison, inmates, gang members and thugs glorified in the movies? Now it's "Cool" to be a "Gangsta" Also, how many times have you heard other staff say, “Well it’s job security” when they are commenting on inmates returning. That is the WRONG attitude as far as I’m concerned... As a society we should be doing EVERYTHING to eliminate crime, criminals and the need for prisons. So some of us are out of a job.. You think that prison is the only job you can do? Think about what a place the United States would be if we put as much effort into eliminating the motivation, the “coolness” if you will, of crime and doing time as we put into blowing up foreign countries and killing terrorists.... Wouldn’t THIS be a nice place to live?

OK...so I'm a long winded old gas bag - fire me!

WOW! I feel like I just ate a Liberal BS Sandwich! Individuals choose to break the law. How is society responsible for that? The more restrictions the Government puts on citizens the more civil liberties you lose. I'm all for killing terrorists and blowing up foriegn countries that need it. It's our responsibility as parents and adults to teach our children to differentiate right from wrong. That's how you lower crime, raise productive children, not criminals. You can't blame the movies.